Change 999060 had a related patch set uploaded (by C. Scott Ananian; author: C. Scott Ananian):

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/999060

I agreed that we can make labs/beta match for languages we are ready to roll-out for production, but we would avoid enabling it in other wikis, including testwiki and testwiki2.

The rationale is to not disrupt worklfows unnecessarily but still prepare ahead for Parsoid Read Views roll-outs.

Note:

• Before we resolved T43716: [EPIC] Support language variant conversion in Parsoid, enabling it in (beta) zhwiki will results in a large number of pages displayed incorrectly.
• Before we resolved T85581: Parsoid page views: need to do something about {{int:}}, enabling it in multilingual wikis such as Meta and Commons will result in pages not displayed in user interface language.

Hello team and @MSantos ,

Rolling out Parsoid read views to beta clusters will negatively affect the work WMDE-TechWish is currently doing for Sub-referencing (product board) because currently we are only able to support the legacy Parser for VE and reader views.

Background info:

• We're currently relying massively on the beta cluster for user testing and gaining insights. Figma Prototypes have proven to be very time consuming, flaky and resource intense to create. This is why we're moving to the beta cluster for the next round of feedbacks, especially with newcomers.

• If Parsoid becomes the default on beta cluster, our feature will break or confuse users. Anyone we send to the beta cluster will have to change settings, if they know how to do that. We hate to overwhelm Newcomers even more :(

It would be great if we can coordinate the rollout and our implementation efforts before this task goes live.
Thanks so much for your understanding!

@Lina_Farid_WMDE could https://patchdemo.wmcloud.org/ be used for your feedback? (I'm not working on this or in the content transform team but am keen to see Parsoid on the beta cluster to test my own features)

In T357054#10701673, @Jdlrobson-WMF wrote:

@Lina_Farid_WMDE could https://patchdemo.wmcloud.org/ be used for your feedback? (I'm not working on this or in the content transform team but am keen to see Parsoid on the beta cluster to test my own features)

@Jdlrobson for your use case, would it work to personally opt-in to Parsoid with an user preference?

That's currently how I am working but I would expect beta to mirror production in the run up to any deployments so that we can reliably test anon workflows. Ie. When we are planning to deploy Parsoid to Spanish Wikipedia to anonymous page views we need a way to test that on Spanish beta in the 2 weeks before. For projects that are not on beta we will need a test environment for anons. I trust you all on the appropriate timing but we will want a reliable beta test environment preceding any major deployments for anonymous users.

We have a few reasonable ways to unblock this situation, so that you're free to configure the beta cluster as you need.

First, from a technical perspective patchdemo is an excellent testing platform and we've already created an instance with an archival version of our "extends" syntax. The performance of that server is better than the beta cluster, and we can curate its entire content and code in a controlled manner. I think the main point of why the task here came to our attention is that we didn't want to be surprised by beta cluster changes in the near future—but that's also a good argument for nudging us towards patchdemo.

Second, we're starting to put together a package of work to implement Parsoid read mode support for our sub-referencing feature and once this is completed there will be no more blocking interdependency between our projects: T387907: [Epic] Sub-referencing support for Parsoid read mode with `details`

Thanks @awight for chiming in. I would like to first understand if a PatchDemo can support our user testing use case end-to-end before we make a decision to use them instead of the beta clusters. We can discuss this internally.

@MSantos and @Jdlrobson-WMF thanks for your patience with us.

I have talked with a few folks in this thread and after looking at our own roadmap we decided that we will not make Parsoid default in beta before the end of May 2025, we can discuss it again if the timeline is not appropriate.

Is there a new timeline for this? (Apologies if this is common knowledge I am still in the process of catching up after being away)

The OKR goal is to switch all Wikipedias to Parsoid Read View by end of this fiscal year (ie, by end of June 2026). And note that is *Wikipedias*, although we've already switched over most wikivoyages and wiktionaries and will probably work on wikisource next, other sister projects are not the primary focus of this year's goal. We've announced this in a number of venues, including staff meetings and at Wikimania this year, but you may have been away.

That said, we need to align beta to this timeline to ensure that folks who are testing on beta and intending to deploy on Wikipedia in the next fiscal year are not surprised by the Parsoid Read Views transition.

We are still discussing this internally on the team and don't have a specific timeline for beta yet. But likely we will switch beta wiktionary and beta wikivoyage to Parsoid to match current deployment status. We plan to resolve the issues mentioned in T357054#10443408 above by the end of Q2. That would probably be the earliest we'd switch beta wikipedias over to Parsoid.

Note that you can still test anon users with and the "Switch to legacy parser" link in the tools dropdown, and that patchdemo is legacy parser by default and currently needs Enable Parsoid by default for patchdemo (1100121) included in your patch set in order to enable Parsoid Read Views. We need to come up with a communication plan to ensure all users of beta and patchdemo are kept in sync with the Parsoid Read Views rollout to avoid surprises, but generally speaking all new features should be tested on both legacy and Parsoid at this point, since transition is within the next 9 months. Also worth noting that Beta *does* have the ParserMigration extension installed, so you can use and user preferences to enable Parsoid on beta for testing as well.

Change #999060 merged by jenkins-bot:

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/999060

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-09T22:14:27Z] <cscott@deploy2002> Started scap sync-world: Backport for [[gerrit:1237373|Disable magic links on nlwiki (T145604)]], [[gerrit:999060|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1237348|Enable site notices on Minerva (T416644)]]

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-09T22:16:22Z] <cscott@deploy2002> jdlrobson, cscott: Backport for [[gerrit:1237373|Disable magic links on nlwiki (T145604)]], [[gerrit:999060|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1237348|Enable site notices on Minerva (T416644)]] synced to the testservers (see https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mwdebug). Changes can now be verified there.

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-09T22:25:48Z] <cscott@deploy2002> Finished scap sync-world: Backport for [[gerrit:1237373|Disable magic links on nlwiki (T145604)]], [[gerrit:999060|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1237348|Enable site notices on Minerva (T416644)]] (duration: 11m 20s)

Change #1238049 had a related patch set uploaded (by C. Scott Ananian; author: C. Scott Ananian):

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/1238049

First patch had a typo, so PRV isn't turned on by default yet.

Change #1238049 merged by jenkins-bot:

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (take 2)

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/1238049

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-10T21:19:13Z] <kemayo@deploy2002> Started scap sync-world: Backport for [[gerrit:1238430|Edit check suggestions beta-feature in allowlist (T399611)]], [[gerrit:1238049|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (take 2) (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1238427|Update title / desc of Special:LintTemplateErrors (T170874)]]

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-10T21:44:08Z] <kemayo@deploy2002> cscott, arlolra, kemayo: Backport for [[gerrit:1238430|Edit check suggestions beta-feature in allowlist (T399611)]], [[gerrit:1238049|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (take 2) (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1238427|Update title / desc of Special:LintTemplateErrors (T170874)]] synced to the testservers (see https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mwdebug). Changes can now be verified there.

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2026-02-10T21:58:59Z] <kemayo@deploy2002> Finished scap sync-world: Backport for [[gerrit:1238430|Edit check suggestions beta-feature in allowlist (T399611)]], [[gerrit:1238049|Turn on Parsoid read views by default on labs (take 2) (T357054)]], [[gerrit:1238427|Update title / desc of Special:LintTemplateErrors (T170874)]] (duration: 39m 46s)